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Wednesday, August 24th 2011, 9:33pm

Activist Orientation Guide - translation problems

Hi,

In this thread I intend to ask a series of questions about content in the Activist Orientation Guide in the hope that others will help me to understand what I can't. It would be nice if everyone that has a question about a word, phrase or a sentence in the AOG posts it here, so that everything would be in one place. This would serve the additional purposes of a) providing a place where everyone can seek and find help, b) possibly making language teams rethink some of their translations and c) setting an example for creating similar threads.

So... The sentence that I have a problem with right now is this one:

Penicillin has saved countless more lives today than any charitable idea or organization.


The word "today" is causing a bit of confusion. It has saved more lives than any charitable idea from its discovery up until this day, or only during this day it has saved more lives than any charitable idea or organization? I couldn't find any info on how much lives penicillin has saved. The second interpretation seems very unlikely to me, but I have no idea how many people are cured by it per day, to be frank.

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Thursday, August 25th 2011, 1:05pm

In this context, 'Today' = From its introduction to the present day.
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Friday, August 26th 2011, 3:28pm

Thanks, Ray. Here is another one.

"Once a very large number of people on the planet join hands in common pursuit of a dramatic social shift, we will begin the next phase, which will put pressure on all nations simultaneously to begin moving out of the monetary structure. Until then, communication, coupled with peaceful social rebellion is key. As a general rule, all social facets that perpetuate the profit system, war and human abuse should be banned".

Now, the last sentence is kind of weird. If you want further context, see pages 81-82 from the AOG. The way I understand it, there should be a ban, among people who identify with this direction, on all social activities (legitimate substitution for "social facets", no?) that perpetuate the profit system. If this is right, then the word "ban" would tend to mean "boycott", not "prohibition". Otherwise it doesn't make sense, because nearly everything perpetuates the profit system.

Multiple problems with this one...

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Saturday, August 27th 2011, 1:34am

Boycott is the correct contextual meaning here, and I do agree that the original sentence is worded rather 'fuzzy'. 8|
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Saturday, August 27th 2011, 1:03pm

Hi,

This sentence I found in chapter 5 (social cybernation unit 9):

In the words of Thorstein Veblen:

"If the country's productive industry were completely organized as a systematic whole, and was then managed by competent technicians... to maximize production of goods and services instead of, as now, being mishandled by ignorant businessmen... to maximize profits, the resulting output of goods and services would doubtless exceed the current output of goods and services by several hundred percent." <ref>Veblin, Thorstein, <i>The Engineers and the Price System</i>, NY B.W. Huebsch, 1921, pp.120-121</ref>

Is the '' ''if the country's productive industry were completely organized as a systematic whole, and was then managed by competent technicians'', then - ''the current output of goods and services by several hundred percent'' would exceed'' - core of all sentence above?

Thanks in advance
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Sunday, August 28th 2011, 10:54am

Hi Laura,
Yes, that is all one sentence, although the punctuation is a bit overdone. Can you provide a link to where you see this?
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Sunday, August 28th 2011, 11:15am

Hey Ray,

Here is a link and thank you again :)

http://pootle.zmlingteam.org/lt/activist…te/#unit=380638
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Wednesday, August 31st 2011, 3:52pm

Hi,

The help has been very useful so far, that's why I come with some more. :P

"For instance, let’s assume we have programmed a computer with the data set consisting of the car in question. A computer has been programmed to know every component, every screw and every electronic pathway, etc., of that vehicle. It has also been programmed with the application of physics so it can relate to the actual cause and effect functionality and operation of the machine, not just its parts".

In the last sentence, the expression "the application of physics" - I'm not sure in which meaning "application" is being used here. Can somebody restate it?

"People think they have “choice” in our current system because they can press a button on a voting machine and put some pre-selected person into power. Once that person is in power, the public then has no power. Did you vote for the space program? Did you vote for the cabinet of the new president? Did you vote for the tax cut?"

Now, a tax cut is a reduction in taxes - something that people would typically consider positive for themselves. However, in the American context I believe it refers to tax cuts [for the rich]? If it is so, I guess we would have to add the missing context.

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Friday, September 2nd 2011, 12:12pm

In the last sentence, the expression "the application of physics" - I'm not sure in which meaning "application" is being used here. Can somebody restate it?


In this context, "with the application of physics" can be restated as "by applying the laws of physics,"


Now, a tax cut is a reduction in taxes - something that people would typically consider positive for themselves. However, in the American context I believe it refers to tax cuts [for the rich]? If it is so, I guess we would have to add the missing context.


Rich or poor is a personal projection here. This context does not specify one way or the other. It should be viewed as ANY tax cut initiated by the government, just as it would make sense if the sentence stated 'tax raise'.
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Friday, September 2nd 2011, 2:56pm

Danke!

Well, I've got some more...

"The fact is, while Neurochemicals and physiological traits set propensities for a person’s reactions and social gravitation, it is the environment that really creates our values and behavior".

Social gravitation? Is it this ? I couldn't find such an expression...

"The Zeitgeist Movement is not a political movement. It does not recognize nations, governments, races, religions, creeds or class. Our understandings conclude that these are now false, outdated distinctions that are far from positive factors for true collective human growth and potential. Their basis is in power division and stratification, not unity and equality, which is our goal".

Wouldn't "power division" mean power being distributed to more people (decentralization)?

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Friday, September 2nd 2011, 11:55pm

"Social gravitation" refers to a person's inclination to gravitate toward various socially acceptable pasttimes and activities (sports fan, activism focus, outdoors activities, compulsive shopping, etc.). The link you provided greatly expands upon this idea, but does not attempt to account for the entire concept. It seems to be more of a description of an attempt to measure the effect than to fully describe the effect itself.

In this context, 'power division' relates to the separation of power by social function. Many examples are available, such as patents that prevent people from using a technology, various governmental departments who's restrictions must be met before a person qualifies for a given benefit, all of the issues that relate to social class (upper, middle, lower), divisions created by rank (owner, manager, blue collar worker, white collar worker, unemployed, colonel, captain, sargent, private, etc.) and many, many others. It is being used here as the opposite of unity.
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Thursday, September 15th 2011, 6:54pm

Hello,

I am not sure what SGS, BLS and U-6 stand for. The closest meaning I found on the internet was - State Geological Survey; Basic Life Support.
Here is the link: http://pootle.linguisticteam.org/lt/acti…te/#unit=380327

And here graph:
''Now, just because money is being pumped into the system does not always mean economic expansion is occurring. This is a critical point. For instance, one of the hallmark indicators of economic expansion is the creation of jobs. Figure 5 below shows the US unemployment levels, including the SGS<note>The SGS Alternate Unemployment Rate reflects current unemployment reporting methodology adjusted for SGS-estimated "discouraged workers" defined away during the Clinton Administration added to the existing BLS estimates of level U-6 unemployment. http://www.shadowstats.com/alternate_data</note> component which takes into account those non-working Americans who are not currently counted as "unemployed" simply because the period of acknowledgment has ended.''
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Wednesday, September 21st 2011, 4:30pm

Hello,

I have a question. What does SGS and U-6 stand for?
As for BLS, I just copied meaning from the other translations in Pootle - Biuro of Labour Statistics. I hope that's correct :)

LInk: http://pootle.linguisticteam.org/lt/acti…te/#unit=380327

Now, just because money is being pumped into the system does not always mean economic expansion is occurring. This is a critical point. For instance, one of the hallmark indicators of economic expansion is the creation of jobs. Figure 5 below shows the US unemployment levels, including the SGS<note>The SGS Alternate Unemployment Rate reflects current unemployment reporting methodology adjusted for SGS-estimated "discouraged workers" defined away during the Clinton Administration added to the existing BLS estimates of level U-6 unemployment. http://www.shadowstats.com/alternate_data</note> component which takes into account those non-working Americans who are not currently counted as "unemployed" simply because the period of acknowledgment has ended.
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Wednesday, September 21st 2011, 9:38pm

Hello,

Thanks for the help :)

http://pootle.zmlingteam.org/lt/activist…te/#unit=380327

Now, just because money is being pumped into the system does not always mean economic expansion is occurring. This is a critical point. For instance, one of the hallmark indicators of economic expansion is the creation of jobs. Figure 5 below shows the US unemployment levels, including the SGS<note>The SGS Alternate Unemployment Rate reflects current unemployment reporting methodology adjusted for SGS-estimated "discouraged workers" defined away during the Clinton Administration added to the existing BLS estimates of level U-6 unemployment. http://www.shadowstats.com/alternate_data</note> component which takes into account those non-working Americans who are not currently counted as "unemployed" simply because the period of acknowledgment has ended.

My question is what does SGS, and U-6 stand for?
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Monday, September 26th 2011, 11:29am

Just testing
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