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Tuesday, January 21st 2014, 2:33pm

Paradise or Oblivion - Can't translate a point Fresco is making without understanding it

In Paradise or Oblivion (http://youtu.be/KphWsnhZ4Ag?t=15m40s) Fresco talks about the 'Gaussian Curve' starting at 15:40 and ending at 15:50.
To translate it into German, I need to understand it first. :) Maybe somebody is able to help.

By my understanding of mathematics a Gaussian curve looks like the following: http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hba…mmath/gauds.gif
Even by concatenating the functions that Fresco draws with his fingers, it would not result in a Gaussian curve. Does he just use the wrong word or is there something else I missed? Maybe he is talking about the cumulative distribution functions for the normal distribution?

I would appreciate any clarification.
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Tuesday, January 21st 2014, 5:34pm

I found nothing in the glossary neither: [url]http://forum.linguisticteam.org/board217-help-desk/board460-specific-issues/board216-the-glossary-a-worldaround-cooperation-production/[/url]
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Tuesday, January 21st 2014, 7:58pm

Nevertheless thank you for looking there and telling me that something like this exists. :) Hopefully somebody will show up soon who knows something about it.
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Tuesday, January 21st 2014, 8:38pm

Moved the thread to the Help Desk, because it is a specific content question. Maybe here more english proofers will show up and help ; )
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Tuesday, January 21st 2014, 10:54pm

I have no real info to give, because maths is not my thing, but, THIS looks a litle more like what he makes with his gestures.

:)

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Wednesday, January 22nd 2014, 10:56am

Thank you for answering kassy, but the picture you posted just shows three Gaussian curves.

However what Fresco shows with his hands is more like
- employment: not really changed
- production: going up a far amount (exponentially)
- purchasing power: going down a far amount (exponentially)
This does not correspond to the Gaussian curve he is referring to.

Maybe you know somebody who's thing is maths and you can ask him/her for help? :)
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Wednesday, January 22nd 2014, 3:50pm

I don't know if this helps clarify or even if it is correct, but what happens to a production that is rising because there are better machines producing more but at the same time there are less employed people and less purchasing power as a consequence? It will reach a threshold and start coming down the same way it went up, right? If all the other variables maintain. Because the lack of purchasing power will make the production collapse. So, if the variables of machine efficiency and unemployment maintain the same progression, so does also purchasing power, and that same influence will no longer make production increase but rather the opposite, after that threshold. That is why the configuration of the Gaussian curve.

I haven't found a source to verify this. It is as poor as my opinion :tongue:
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Thursday, January 23rd 2014, 11:40am

That's an explanation which satisfies me. Maybe I was taking it too literally. So Fresco talks about the Gaussian curve meaning that we are over the threshold. After this he states, why this happened. It makes perfect sense to me.
So I am able to translate it more clearly now.

It's amazing to have people like you all here with similar values to talk about such things. People like you are very rare in daily life. :)
This way we all increase our understanding of the concepts even more. Thank you very much again.
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This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "ossi11111" (Jan 23rd 2014, 8:08pm)


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Thursday, January 23rd 2014, 10:10pm

I am glad to have you and everyone else around too, making all this possible ^^
Still, I would feel safer if @Di Anna: @Suze: @lizardman: @Ray: or other folks around who know the subject well, would share their thoughts here.


By the way, there are more stuff happening in the forum besides translations and transcriptions, I don't know if you are aware of them but your thoughts are also very valuable there, as a very present agent in this community, hehe. Here are some links:

Attracting New Members & Keeping the Old Ones

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Making the Timeshifting Stage Obsolete
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Friday, January 24th 2014, 12:08am

I think Rod explained the reasoning behind Jacque's use of a Gaussian Curve quite well. I'm sure Jacque doesn't expect the future to follow the standard GC exactly, but remember that he's trying to help people understand complicated subjects using relatively simple language. ;)
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Friday, January 24th 2014, 3:05pm

Nice explanations here! I agree with them both. :clap:
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Friday, January 24th 2014, 5:02pm

I hate to throw a spanner in the works at this point, but after discussing this with my husband (who is a math wiz and engineer), I've come to the conclusion that the gesture Jacque seems to be making may be a Folium of Descartes curve.

File:FoliumDescartes.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I don't know how important the name of the curve is; the message is the same - "We are over the threshold." Will it be a big deal for Jacque detractors if the name of the curve is incorrect?

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Friday, January 24th 2014, 5:48pm

Lol, Suze... way above my head.
Maybe the correct procedure would be to ask Jacque. 8|
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Saturday, January 25th 2014, 12:08pm

I hate to throw a spanner in the works at this point, but after discussing this with my husband (who is a math wiz and engineer), I've come to the conclusion that the gesture Jacque seems to be making may be a Folium of Descartes curve.

This may be correct for the curve he is drawing about production. However, it seems to me, that he just thinks about how to go on with the curve and does not want to draw a Folium of Descartes. If he really does draw a Folium of Descartes how could you explain that production is described by such a curve? What about the other curves? Is your husband into TVP, too? Because for me, it sounds like he just watched Fresco's fingers without regarding the context. Why should Fresco use a largely unknown function in a documentary which aims to reach 'normal people'?

Maybe you let him answer in the Forum directly. I personally do need more explanation on this now. :) I studied Computer Science, so I am able to understand a little bit of mathematics, so it is not necessary to start explaining from 101. ;)

Nevertheless thank you for asking and thinking about the subject. Maybe you can ask your husband again to elaborate on that further. :D

Maybe the correct procedure would be to ask Jacque.

That would be the last step, if we cannot find it out ourselves. For me nomada's explanation still makes the most sense. Let's just wait on what Suze's husband has to say, before talking about the next steps.
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Saturday, January 25th 2014, 2:28pm

You are right ossi11111.

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